the cooling system and overheating problem

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the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by starrcat2 on Mon May 25, 2015 12:43 am

 
Okay, I know everyone must of battled the overheating problem these cars have......or are still fighting it.  I'd like to hear how
everyone has resolved the problem....or what they've done in trying to resolve it.  I'm new to the group, and I've got alot of questions for
all you seasoned owners.  Thanks in advance for all the input.......
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by starrcat2 on Tue May 26, 2015 7:04 pm

what is the problem with the green coolant and an aluminum motor ?
thanks for your reply.
Starr
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Wed May 27, 2015 3:01 pm

While I agree with Keith on using Dexcool if possible, most don't want to or know how to deal with flushing the system to rid of all the old green style coolant.  Easiest thing ( and is what Ive done with great success ) is to add some coolant additive like Water Wetter ( or equivalent ) to your existing coolant.  They can be found at Autozone or any other parts store and this will inhibit corrosion and lower coolant temps too by 10+ degrees.

I've also added an recovery tank and 15# rad cap which will raise the boiling point. No more coolant loss, in fact it adds a few extra quarts to the capacity of the system. BONUS!

Additionally, if you've converted over to an alternator you can now add an E-fan too which will help tremendously at traffic stops. Just my 2 cents worth...

Josh

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Thu May 28, 2015 3:50 am

woody1640 wrote:Josh: Thats 2 things I forgot to mention that I am going to do to mine as well ... I'm glad you posted your responce ... thanks
Keith

For sure Keith!! We're in this to win this together as a team! Basketball cheers Very Happy

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Thu May 28, 2015 8:26 am

I should add a couple other tips if Starr finds herself stuck in traffic with creeping temps, tho she might already know these....

#1 -- Turn your heater on full blast -- this will remove some heat from the coolant.

#2 -- Put the car in neutral and hold rpms at a constant 1000-1500rpms, this will move the fan faster and help with heat dispertion.

#3 -- For Starr ( and anyone else in warmer climates ), if the ambient temp never gets down to a freezing point you maybe better suited to run a 65/35 ( or more ) of water/coolant.  Water has a better heat transfer and so the more water you run the cooler things should run.

Josh

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by starrcat2 on Mon Jun 01, 2015 2:10 pm

Thanks Josh. Very helpful.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by Bill on Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:39 pm

Josh- do you have a suggestion on an e-fan, or just pick up a generic one from Autozone? I was wondering if you knew of one that might fit better out of the box than another.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by Bill on Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:40 pm

Josh - I just put on two pusher fans on the front of my radiator. both are 8 inchers. I am also adding on a water temp gauge. Does anyone have an opinion on what temp I should set the efans to go on at? I was thinking 200-210 degrees based on the 180 degree thermostat.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:51 am

Bill wrote:Josh- do you have a suggestion on an e-fan, or just pick up a generic one from Autozone? I was wondering if you knew of one that might fit better out of the box than another.

Bill wrote:Josh - I just put on two pusher fans on the front of my radiator. both are 8 inchers. I am also adding on a water temp gauge. Does anyone have an opinion on what temp I should set the efans to go on at? I was thinking 200-210 degrees based on the 180 degree thermostat.

So weird that I didn't get any notification that you posted these posts...

Anywhoo, I ended up with this fan... http://www.summitracing.com/parts/prm-19129 and I set it to come on around 200* and off at 180* -- It seems to like to run around 190* down the road and when Im stopped at lights it does start to creep up, I played with it till it held the temp to about that same temp while sitting at a light for a LONG time during an 90* day -- I guess I'm a little more concerned with temps than Keith's partner ( by no means saying he's wrong ) but with it being an all aluminum motor I'd rather err on the low side -- it could only take one time overheating to ruin these motors I suspect.  I wouldn't want to see it get over 210* for any real length of time personally.

I mounted mine on front as well so I could keep the crank driven fan as well.  According to the docs as a pusher fan it moves about 1800 CFM -- what are your dual 8's pushing?

Additionally, I might add I have no idea what temp the fans are seeing at the probe inserted in the rad -- I set mine up based on what I was reading off the gauge and that's pullin' temps from near the thermo housing. Might very well be in the 225* range at the probe....

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:25 pm

For what it's worth I've always been told as a rule of thumb you want the fans to turn off about ten degrees hotter than your thermostat setting and turn on is usually 10-15 degrees higher than that. What thermostat temp are you going to be running? If you haven't put it in yet be sure to verify in a hot pan of water what temp it fully opens -- alot of times they aren't fully open for a few more degrees past what its rated for...

IE a 180* thermo might not fully open till say 188* so you'd want to have fans come on at around 210 and off at 198-200 -- Ive been running a 160* thermo in mine so the 180* OFF works for me and the 200* ON is about as high as Id like to see it get before it kicks them on to start aiding in cooling because my car runs right at around 190* unless Im stopped at a light.

I don't necessarily think there is a right or wrong answer or they wouldn't make these controllers adjustable, they'd all have set on and off temps -- the main thing is to not be under the temp your thermo is open ( you don't want it cycling open and closed ) and then find a spot you're comfortable with and for me that's below 210* as I don't want it running any hotter then that ever... just my opinion...

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by Bill on Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:25 am

Well I can tell you that one overheat doesn't ruin the engine - Unfortunately it happened to me about a month ago. I had been driving it for a while on short trips. My mechanic said that I should let the engine warm up for at least 5 minutes prior to driving the car. I hadn't put on the pusher fans yet and I parked it on a slight slope while it was warming up. My brother in law had just bought a new RV and I was checking it out. I was probably away from the car for 8 minutes, and when I returned the temp light was on and fluid was dripping out from the upper radiator hose clamp. I shut it down right away and then did not touch the car for several hours.

When I came back to get it home (1 mile drive) it ran fine. I took it to the mechanic and he said he doubted very much that I damaged anything since I caught it so quickly. I have driven it a lot since then and have no issues, nor has it overheated again. I think the slight (and I mean slight) slope it was parked on prevented the fluid from moving properly. I brought it back to them the other day and they looked it over again and found no issues.

My initial thought was to run it colder as well, but of course you can cause a lot of damage with not letting an engine warm up either. The stock thermostat was for 180 degrees, so I figured it should run slightly warmer than that (195? 200?). I will probably start at 200 and see how that goes. I am putting in a temp gauge (hence the other post) and want to see what it runs at without the fans. I figure I will let it run a little hotter than normal and then have the fans come on.

Does anyone know what temp the idiot light comes on at? That might be a good starting point too.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by Bill on Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:29 am

I just looked at my amazon account to see what my fans were rated for. I guess I got 10s. Not sure why I thought I had 8s. Here they are -

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00T3T7IJU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00

1000 CFM a piece is what they were rated for.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:35 am

woody1640 wrote:Josh: Since I swapped my carb out for the fuel injection setup I went with what the rover 3.9L normally runs and if I recall correctly its a 190 degree thermo. I eliminated the 4 blade fan and bought 2 12" electric fans which will be turned on/off (controlled) by the computer and most computer systems for fuel injected cars have the electric fans turn on at 225 degree. I am hoping that this set up will work, I guess time will tell.

Keith

I don't doubt that the rover motor runs hotter, most EFI engines do but they do that with new head designs, better engine efficiency, accurate control of fuel/air/timing, and emissions requirements. I'm certain that you will likely be ok with the fans coming on at 225* and shutting off around 205-210* but why would you wanna let a vintage, high compression aluminum engine get much hotter than 210* in the first place? I'd think that you'd wanna have the engine operate where it was intended too regardless of what the present day comparable does -- you're only swapping the air/fuel/timing control not the entire slightly redesigned engine...

I'm certainly not sayin' you're wrong in your assessment but I personally won't let mine get that hot.

Bill wrote:I just looked at my amazon account to see what my fans were rated for. I guess I got 10s. Not sure why I thought I had 8s. Here they are -

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00T3T7IJU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00

1000 CFM a piece is what they were rated for.

You said you plan to use them at a pusher right? Just be aware you'll lose about 20% of the CFM when doing so, just the nature of the beast. So your two fans will push about 1600 CFM. Are you using a probe that activates the fan controller or a thermoswitch that goes into the intake somewhere? Also, be sure when installing them that you put your hand in front of rad ( engine side ) and confirm you've got rotation right -- last thing you want is for the fans to be fighting the crank driven fan. That would be no bueno.

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by Bill on Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:56 am

I have a probe mounted under the inlet of the radiator out of the way of the pusher fans. It came with a clamp and it sits about 1/4 inch off the radiator. I must have checked 5 times to make sure I had the right rotation on the fans. I used my hand and a piece of paper just to put my mind at ease. That overheating moment terrified me to the core, and I felt especially stupid since I had these pushers sitting in a box at home when it happened. I just hadn't gotten to it yet and the car gave me no indication this would ever happen. Woodward is this weekend and I decided I don't want to bring the Skylark after this until I have everything ironed out (or at least a water temp gauge), so I am a little bummed out. I have a rental reserved with Enterprise, but they couldn't guarantee me a sports car, so I will likely be ten times more depressed rolling up in a dumba$$ fusion.

I guess it is better than ending up with a worse incident, or breaking down on the side of the interstate with two of my kids in the car. I guess there is next year.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:57 am

Look on the bright side at least it happened close to home and not hours away. That would've sucked a whole lot worse. No reason not to be bummed but no reason not to be patient either. Atleast you're going to Woodward. Sometimes you have to take a step back to move forward -- doing that against my own desires myself with the 455 in my regal -- just set it into place Tuesday and now it has to come back out cuz the darn TQ converter is in a bind -- think the darn crank snout is gummed up with rust, paint, or both -- irritating and a big PITA to say the least but as they say **** happens....

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by Bill on Mon Aug 17, 2015 9:39 pm

Well the good news is that I installed my water temp gauge last night. I think it looks pretty good, but I really should have cut down the bezel that came with the meter. With the bezel it is recessed a little, which makes it hard to see when the temp is under 150 or so from the driver seat, which I guess is not a big deal. Here is what it looks like -



Bad news is - my pusher fans seem to do nothing, and my car gets as hot as 225 when scooting around during a test. Did anyone come up with a point at which the idiot light comes on? I may start poking around on some rover boards to figure it out. As far as the pushers I guess I will have to remount and try again.
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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:10 am

Bill: Gauge looks good! Looks factory fresh! Very Happy

Quick question -- can you post a pic of where and how you've got the probe installed? Also, do you know where you have the turn on temp set at?

Don't move the pushers yet -- as long as rotation is correct you cant have much more space to place them and they should be fine as is...

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Re: the cooling system and overheating problem

Post by regal81455 on Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:15 am

Also, the temp switch for dummy light is activated @ 263* +/- 10*.  affraid   Part # is TU46.

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